Warriors and You!

[Broxigan]

So, the only other thread I saw within here is the one about a month before the expansion. Figured it would be good to go ahead and bring up in a new thread.

So, warrior PVP. I am pretty darn sure Arms is going to be just as good, if not better, than it used to be. Personally, me going PVP on my warrior will be a new twist since I plan on being more of a DPS role [which is doable!] than a tank. Those are the plans, anyway.

So, anyone have specific strats against certain classes? Specific builds? Thoughts on Fury PVP, Arms PVP or even Prot PVP?

[Leyujin]

I have been searching for the zaniest fury heavy, prot skill focused pvp build I can come up with. I doubt any of them are very efficient, but I'm trying to find the balance between ease of use and effectiveness.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LZhxfsxVurcobkNorIzrx
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LcbcZhxfsxVurjobkhorI0b

Those two are the main permutations I've been looking at, or some variation thereof. I've really enjoyed the essentially standard prot build for pvp, so I don't mind remaining as that. A two-hander and a shield aren't great synergy, I realize. But I've seen it once before, and the image is just sooooo seductive. Like the dark side, I feel the call. Any suggestions on making the least gimped, titan grip/shield pvp build possible? Losing warbringer is a big blow, I absolutely love it.

[Yatokth]

You asked for it.

Arms and Prot are rape in PvP. Haven't tried Fury, though the utility of Heroic Fury is undeniable, but otherwise they don't have much going for them except beefy whirlwinds and death wish. And an unreliable healing debuff.

I much prefer Arms myself, Bladestorm is fantastic, and the amount of burst you can get from properly chaining overpower procs, execute procs, whirlwinds, and even revenges if you're feeling bastardly, is SICK.

Some people will try to tell you that Taste for Blood and such Battle Stance talents aren't worth it. DON'T LISTEN. Rend is amazing damage now, and Overpower Procs along with Executes usually keep you busy, and if you're hurtin, throw off a mocking blow or stance dance for a WW since you should have 3/3 Tact mastery.

WHAT ABOUT PUMMEL, YAT??!1/11/ Well if you have a laggy comp this could be problematic, but now that it's off the GCD you can dance > pummel even RIGHT after using an ability, it's not an issue. Same with intercept.

And in battle stance you're not eating that 10% damage to your face, which is HUGE.

Also, if you have improved hamstring + hamstring glyph and you're specced into imp slam, every time that procs, you can fire off a good 2-3 slams before the guy can gtfo from you. And slams are rage efficient and they HURT when they crit due to no normalization from not being an instant.

I'll make another post about Prot PvP later on down the line, suffice to say it's entertaining and hilarious.

As for your idea Leyujin, while it isn't conventional, I have to say the imagery is tempting. Losing Warbringer for heroic fury isn't exactly the greatest thing, but here's going to be a few suggestions on that build:

Shield Slam basically replaces Whirlwind, so GET SHIELD MASTERY. =D

Use those revenges, son! Want improved revenge.

Imp Cleave sucks ass! Don't take it! Ever!

If you wanna try a build like that, hit up something like this:

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warrior=00000000000000000000000000000025030122320 0000000000000000325000134005312053102511301&glyph=020816050201

Imp Spell Reflect is godly. Do it.

This build still won't be all that great, but it'll be the most optimal not-that-great you'll ever play. And lulzy.

[Leyujin]

I wanted Improved Cleave because I love Saurfang, and want his babies. Plus I have this vision of me in Wintergrasp, surrounded by Alliance, and pulling off cleave crits with that two hander ten times in a row.

Okay, I'll drop it -.-.

The only thing that confuses me about your build is the improved berserker stance. Do you assume I'd be in that most of the time, switching out to defensive to spell reflect/revenge? My issue would be, lacking tactical mastery, there's a lot of rage that would potentially bleed out there. Or have I been misreading the talent this whole time and it's just a flat 10% attack power bonus in any stance?

[Yatokth]

I wanted Improved Cleave because I love Saurfang, and want his babies. Plus I have this vision of me in Wintergrasp, surrounded by Alliance, and pulling off cleave crits with that two hander ten times in a row.

Okay, I'll drop it -.-.

The only thing that confuses me about your build is the improved berserker stance. Do you assume I'd be in that most of the time, switching out to defensive to spell reflect/revenge? My issue would be, lacking tactical mastery, there's a lot of rage that would potentially bleed out there. Or have I been misreading the talent this whole time and it's just a flat 10% attack power bonus in any stance?

No, I was being stupid!

Let me change that for you!

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warrior=00000000000000000000000000000025030122320 0000000000000000325050134005312053102011301&glyph=020816050201

Unbridled Wrath is of marginal use, so if you wanna drop those three into imp cleave, then go ahead, with incite the lulz of cleaving WOULD be great. But you can get epic cleves without the imp cleave talent, as it only increases the static damage.

[nandien]

Imp cleave needs a buff, like x% additional attack power per talent point or something.

Also, warriors hurt (except in bearform). What exactly can you cc a warrior with while bladestorming? Stuns? Cyclone? Disarm? I thought I stopped one yesterday, but I'm not sure.

[Yatokth]

Also, warriors hurt (except in bearform). What exactly can you cc a warrior with while bladestorming? Stuns? Cyclone? Disarm? I thought I stopped one yesterday, but I'm not sure.

You can't.

[nandien]

That's what I thought, just making sure.

[Broxigan]

How about this as a question:

Is Commanding Presence really that important? The only thing that it is good for is Commanding Shout, since Battle Shout can get run over by Might.

[Keraph]

If you're full arms you simply don't have the points to max it out anyways, because 3/3 Blood Craze is NEEDED in PvP. The heals are MUCH nicer now, and more noticeable

[Fallacy]

My Fury PvP spec. (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warrior=05003300233000000000000000000000000000000 0000000000000000325000131005312053122511051&glyph=030721030201)

[Broxigan]

If you're full arms you simply don't have the points to max it out anyways, because 3/3 Blood Craze is NEEDED in PvP. The heals are MUCH nicer now, and more noticeable

Right. This is what I did. I took the vitals in Fury, and 3/3 in Blood Craze and with my last three points, I am popping them into imp ham which fills me out at 80. I know alot of people don't like to have imp charge, but I find it to be helpful with rage, especially if Sudden Death procs right off.

[Keraph]

I know alot of people don't like to have imp charge, but I find it to be helpful with rage, especially if Sudden Death procs right off.

I'm torn on the matter. In arenas, there are a lot of ways to ensure you get the charge off, especially with the +5 yards glyph, but there are also many ways to have it taken from you. Once you've lost the ability to charge, unless there's a break in the combat or you get CC'd and ignored long enough, you won't have the opportunity to charge again, leaving those talent points more or less unused. Additionally, in my build I'm not precisely sure where I would redirect the points to afford it.

By the way, this is my currently planned Arms build. It's gone through a LOT of tinkering, and fairly extensive testing on the beta pre-release, so I'm feeling pretty good about it. (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/warrior/talents.html?tal=032032202333510023221023131251325 00013000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 0)

[Broxigan]

How about a little spice. What do you guys think about Prot in PvP? Right now, for instance/rep purposes, I am prot....again...and I am finding it to be pretty awesome. PvP in defensive stance? :O

Imp Revenge + Revenge Glyph = Free heroic strike + uber damage.

In the crafted PvP set, I can usually pop off some pretty big Revenge crits, ranging between 3k and 4k. Shield Slams and Sword and Board only add to the sexiness of it all. The ability to shield block/shield wall can make you an unstoppable force [see: distraction to break up turtles.] plus the stuns and Thunderclap, which is also very nice now it seems.

I do miss my executes, bladestorm and 6k crits...but man, I can survive 'more' mobs at a time. PVE.

Thoughts?

Here is my build.
link (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Twisting+Nether&n=Broxy)

Now, I am sure I could have picked up Imp Disarm. And I just noticed Gag Order [wtf] also includes a silence on Heroic Throw. Hm...

[Keraph]

Prot PvP is hella effective nowadays. It used to be that pre 3.0, they were irritating to melee, but they'd still go down, it just took a while. Now they actually do DAMAGE while mitigating all of mine (nothing makes me more sad than popping bladestorm and seeing BLOCKBLOCKBLOCKPARRYBLOCK 500~ ;o;). With revenge damage being static, you're guaranteed some solid burst, and S&B can provide more burst with random extra shield slams as well. I've been taken down by prot wars/pallys in the recent past, they're nothing to laugh at. The downside? If you're not the only target available, all of that defense goes to waste as people will ignore you in favor of the more easily killed targets.

Also, if you're serious about prot for PvP, really wanna get Gag Order and Imp disarm to shut down casters and melee more thoroughly.

[Broxigan]

See, Gag Order changed at some point and I didn't notice it. Heroic throw silence?! GIMME!

Edit: I gotta find some place to pull 4 points from... x_x

[Rhowen-Prea]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warrior=05023321230301002100000000000000000000000 0000000000000000305030130505310050102501000&glyph=030721030201

My Fury PvP build. I do not have a warrior to 80 yet, so I'm not quite sure how it will function. But looking forward to it. People laugh at my ridiculous non-conformist Fury PvP builds.

Until I blender their face into pulp. Then they're rolling Warrior Alts and asking me how to spec up.

[Okhu]

Prot Warriors are friggin crazy. :[....Sticking thier big barrely chests in my face and critting for 3K with Concussive Blow... then 1K Slapping me with Shieldslam...and then another 1K from thier shockwave..... Oooooww D:

[Yatokth]

Prot Warriors are friggin crazy. :[....Sticking thier big barrely chests in my face and critting for 3K with Concussive Blow... then 1K Slapping me with Shieldslam...and then another 1K from thier shockwave..... Oooooww D:

1K shockwave? Pssh.

More like 3K. Shockwave and conc blow are the same. ;)

My Prot PvP build:

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warrior=35020000200000000000000000000025030122522 0012520330113321305000000000000000000000000&glyph=161302030201

[Okhu]

The Shockwave didn't crit.

[Yatokth]

The Shockwave didn't crit.

BUT IT SHOULD HAVE

[Leyujin]

Oh god, that titan grip/shield build was even worse than I could possibly have imagined. Maybe if you had optimized gear for it, it wouldn't be a free kill for everyone and their mother. I'm going back to 51 prot! <stomps off to sulk>

[Okhu]

Prots the way to go.

[Yatokth]

Oh god, that titan grip/shield build was even worse than I could possibly have imagined. Maybe if you had optimized gear for it, it wouldn't be a free kill for everyone and their mother. I'm going back to 51 prot! <stomps off to sulk>

Probably not.

[Agnarr]

I'm noticing as I level up I get owned hard by lower and lower levels. It's pretty pathetic getting roflstomped by someone 7 levels lower than you, but it's happening to me all the time now.
Of course, its always mages/warlocks/death knights/priests/paladins

[Gorymoru]

I don't understand that either...you think maybe it's as you replace more and more resilience gear with non resilience gear? I'm not sure. I just know that I always went down rather fast on Zorael. That could be only because I had 12k hp at the most as SL/SL, and 413 resilience. Usually it was the full s4 rogues that I met. Critcritcrit stun CRIT!!!!!! dead.

[Agnarr]

I have finally realized the bane of my existence in PVPing as a warrior. Charge stun happens as soon as you activate the ability, not when you hit the target. So if it takes you a second of game time to reach your target, the stun has already worn off. That coupled with latency (even though I have high speed access and live 20 miles from the effing servers) means they're off and running before you ever reach them, even being stunned.

And then there's the constant "You are too far away to do that" problem, at the same time your melee target is smacking the crap out of you (or three-shotting you in the case of retardins).

[Yatokth]

I'm noticing as I level up I get owned hard by lower and lower levels. It's pretty pathetic getting roflstomped by someone 7 levels lower than you, but it's happening to me all the time now.
Of course, its always mages/warlocks/death knights/priests/paladins

Wait til Season 5 PvP epics.

You will then rape face.

[Kyrion]

Broxy, coming from a rogue perspective. I really don't have any problems with arms/fury warriors for pvp at all. Its the fucking prot warriors that really pack a punch.

[Agnarr]

Not necessarily a PVP question but the warrior talent that increases crit chance, states that it increases crit chance with weapons. Does this actually include such things as thunderclap and shockwave, or is it strictly weapon-only skills?

[Yatokth]

Not necessarily a PVP question but the warrior talent that increases crit chance, states that it increases crit chance with weapons. Does this actually include such things as thunderclap and shockwave, or is it strictly weapon-only skills?

Everything.

[Shalis]

Broxy, coming from a rogue perspective. I really don't have any problems with arms/fury warriors for pvp at all. Its the fucking prot warriors that really pack a punch.

Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.
Damage Shield hits you for 234.

I think you're right about Arms warriors, although Fury warriors seem to give me some trouble. So many instant attacks, so much berserker rage. I almost feel like it'd be prudent to apply Anesthetic Poison to my offhand just to have a little more control over the fight, but then I remember that that's stupid.

[Broxigan]

So yeah...Prot is so fracking sexy right now. I don't feel pigeon holed into just tanking anymore. I love it.

I need to find people to duel. I took down a mage who tried to kite me three times the other day during a duel. I felt happy.

[Agnarr]

So yeah...Prot is so fracking sexy right now. I don't feel pigeon holed into just tanking anymore. I love it.

I need to find people to duel. I took down a mage who tried to kite me three times the other day during a duel. I felt happy.

How? I get rooted and kited by ranged attackers all.the.time. Of course, I don't have the PVP trinket to get out of movement prevention things.

[Broxigan]

How? I get rooted and kited by ranged attackers all.the.time. Of course, I don't have the PVP trinket to get out of movement prevention things.

Warbinger.

Maybe the mage didn't know not to stay completely out of range. He stayed a good 20 yards away casting all his instants [Arcane mage] and I kep spell reflecting his spells, he would use mana shield. I just kept at him until I he ran out of mana then I just slammed him.

Not to mention Concussion blows, Shockwave, Shield Bash [now with daze] and revenge procs.

[Bahlmoral]

I'm inclined to believe that was a retarded mage then.

Don't get me wrong, Prot PvP has a ton more survivability against mages than Arms does, but when it boils right down to it they're still our counter class.

If you're going to Prot PvP, I would take points out of Improved Revenge. There are enough ranged dealers that it take the usefulness right out of revenge. Yes great against the melee classes, but for the points you'd be better off putting it in Improved Disarm. That can be used all the time and increases damage output to the disarmed target by 10%.

That to me is points better spent.

[Bahlmoral]

I'm torn on the matter. In arenas, there are a lot of ways to ensure you get the charge off, especially with the +5 yards glyph, but there are also many ways to have it taken from you. Once you've lost the ability to charge, unless there's a break in the combat or you get CC'd and ignored long enough, you won't have the opportunity to charge again, leaving those talent points more or less unused. Additionally, in my build I'm not precisely sure where I would redirect the points to afford it.

By the way, this is my currently planned Arms build. It's gone through a LOT of tinkering, and fairly extensive testing on the beta pre-release, so I'm feeling pretty good about it. (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/warrior/talents.html?tal=032032202333510023221023131251325 00013000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 0)

Why would you not put 2/2 in Strength of Arms? As a warrior I know I find absolutely no use out of a talent that increases my strangth, stamina and expertise...

[Yatokth]

Why would you not put 2/2 in Strength of Arms? As a warrior I know I find absolutely no use out of a talent that increases my strangth, stamina and expertise...

Because straight up damage increase and lowered cast time on a non-normalized attack that smashes face > str and sta, and minor expertise bonus.

It's good for PvE.

Not so for PvP, better stuff to get.

[Ryoku]

I know I'm ressurecting a dead topic, but I have to say that I've been leveling my little warrior prot since about level 18 and so far it is beautiful, BEAUTIFUL solo, and I'm hoping will only get better as I continue to get more prot-based damaging abilities.

So, I'm just going to say that for a player who has a decent amount of intuition, and fair familiarity with the game, prot is DEFINATELY a viable leveling specc now as well.

[Keraph]

Because straight up damage increase and lowered cast time on a non-normalized attack that smashes face > str and sta, and minor expertise bonus.

It's good for PvE.

Not so for PvP, better stuff to get.

Pretty much what he said. Strength of Arms is good, but when held up against other potential talents in a PvP setting, it just falls a bit short.

Trust me, it was very hard to work it out of my build ;o;

[Agnarr]

I know I'm ressurecting a dead topic, but I have to say that I've been leveling my little warrior prot since about level 18 and so far it is beautiful, BEAUTIFUL solo, and I'm hoping will only get better as I continue to get more prot-based damaging abilities.

So, I'm just going to say that for a player who has a decent amount of intuition, and fair familiarity with the game, prot is DEFINATELY a viable leveling specc now as well.

I didn't have any problems with it when I leveled prot, and I started that just a little bit under a year ago.