Elemental Shamans

[Fhenrir]

Spawned from the "Ask a Gladiator" thread. Anyone with experience playing as or against an elemental shaman can chime in here with any observations or questions they may have!

[Raziel]

I used to be fully elemental pre-BC. Good Times. I still dress that way.

[Qabian]

Weeell, in my definitely limited experience, they spell lock almost as nicely as Paladins, and have a tendency to run around flailing and dying when the nature school gets locked out. So what Fhen said in his Gladiator thread about pole dancing (breaking line of sight), using instants when possible, and faking casts with strafing when you think you're about to get countered/kicked around mages/rogues also applies to caster shaman?

From a mage perspective, assuming you're actually managing to stay at range, Grounding Totem is something to remember as well, but because the cooldown is so long, you probably want to plan ahead and try to time/strategize when to actually use it so it doesn't just get lanced or scorched and actually eats something huge like a PoMPyro or a Shatter combo.

[Chikt]

Elemental Shaman will be much more difficult to fight in Wrath due to the fact that we get a decent Fire spell to be able to use when locked out of the Nature tree, but it is still one of our big issues. The moment we're locked out of that tree, we have to focus on one of our lesser trees. But in a sense we'll be comparable or even better than Mages in Wrath, in that we will have powerful abilities to fall back on if our main arsenal is taken out.

I'm a big proprietor of Instant Ghost Wolf, for ANY Shaman PvP spec. 5% extra crit on Lightning and Heals from the Resto tree is great and all, and insta-casting is amazing, but it's only ever going to help you if you are ALIVE. I believe in Wrath, the Insta-Cast Shaman are going to be disappearing in favor of the new "turret" spec. We have 70% spell pushback with talents now, so we don't need to blow our load at the start. Instant Ghost Wolf will be a viable option for Elemental.

Use Earthbind and Instant Ghost Wolf together to kite around classes or make a hasty escape and lick your wounds.

A lot of this is just theory, but going through our current talents it seems a good idea to start investing a lot of points into the abilities that enhance our Fire tree alongside our Nature tree so we have a damn good fallback for those occasions where we DO get locked out of throwing Lightning Bolts. I've not heard much about Lava Burst, which is often a good sign as far as classes go. But I'm going to have to do a lot of experimentation with lava Burst to make a real good judgement on wether or not a lot of the talents for it are worth it.

My little experimental spec (I say experimental because I fully expect to take away a lot of the talents in the Elemental tree after I see just how useful they are) for 3.02 currently looks something like this (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?shaman=553000150321505100530351000000000000000000 000000000050003000000000000000000000) so I can try out everything before Wrath. In all honesty I don't know what sort of spec I'd use at 80 if the skills changed now. So many of them look so good, and I have a lot of ideas in mind for how they could be put to use (using Lava Burst and Flame Shock quite a bit one idea - but would require 5 points in Reverberation that I am having a hard time finding out how to spare without sacrificing hit rating and base damage on Lava Burst). I'd be kinda torn between this spec for more damage output (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?shaman=553000150301535100530351550000000000000000 000000000050020000000000000000000000) or this spec for more survivability. (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?shaman=551000150301535100530351550000200000000000 000000000050020000000000000000000000) But there's only two points difference between them.

Given how things are going to change VERY soon, I think I'm going to leave it at that and give more opinion once I try my experimental spec.

[Advurb]

Resto Shamans getting the shaft in Wrath makes me cry.

I haven't read much on elemental but I hope it's viable at least.

[Chikt]

Resto Shamans getting the shaft in Wrath makes me cry.

I haven't read much on elemental but I hope it's viable at least.

Eh, after seeing that as Resto we're being pushed into a "raiding only" corner with no good PvP stuff at the bottom of the tree (which Spirit Link was perfect for) I just decided that I should go Elemental PvP and cut my losses.

The only bad stuff I've heard is that we're getting out-dpsed by tanks in raids. An issue that other classes are also struggling with.

[Jabiba]

Shaman PvP? I don't know how it works in 3s, but if you wanna Arena in Fives, you're a focus target, you'll die or live through the first wave. You want high resilience. Period. And its really hard to get locked out in the beginning because all you're doing anyways is purging, purging anyone and everything so that pally bubbles and priest shields any any other "saving grace" move that is popped.. can be purged the second it is cast. your goal is to purge and survive to cast. You don't want to blow your cooldowns early other than bloodlust, if your group deems its worth to use at the start or if you just dont' have the life/resilience to last long enough to pop it after the initial wave. If you get locked out? Flametongue doesn't all out suck you do have spell damage, if that fails, go pick up an epic two hander and slap windfury and mongoose on it... or Deathfrost, its handy. Hell Deathfrost can proc off off your lightning shields.

Totems? Windfury for your other players, grounding if you see a bunch of casts, but its not too likely once your rating goes up, they'll know to use an insta cast to let the long cast actually hit. Air: Windfury (or Wrath of air if for some reason you don't have a warrior or something equal) Water: Poison Cleansing.. make rogues regret you knowing that you have *a lot* of totems. Fire, Searing/magma/fire nova. They're all good when used proper. Earth: Also situational. Str is good for your melee, earthbind is good for when you have to play the retarded "run around the pole" dance. In the expansion str will be really good since it'll grant agility and thusly dodge.

Oh and to note out, If you go resto for the crit, i'm going to smack you upside the head. In the enhancment tree the crit applies to both melee AND SPELLS. So you can just get your five points that way without throwing away a lot of points elsewhere. And if you want insta ghost wolf you can get that too. I likely won't, but you can if you want it.

Oh and Dio people dont' go resto for the 5% crit when they spec PvP, its good use and all but that's not the *PvP* spec. When I spec PvP with Jabbers, while I still have that talent, Focused Mind is where its all at. Reduce your silenced duration so when you are locked out, it doesn't last as long. Its huge.

And also if people want a good PvE based elemental spec, i've got mine figured out, I haven't bothered tinkering with a PvP spec yet, partially because focused mind is still in the resto tree, and the question still remains, is lockout an issue now with another spell to cast? i'm going to guess no though seeing how you can flameshock, then lava burst for some sweet combo point action.

[Chikt]

Oh and to note out, If you go resto for the crit, i'm going to smack you upside the head. In the enhancment tree the crit applies to both melee AND SPELLS. So you can just get your five points that way without throwing away a lot of points elsewhere. And if you want insta ghost wolf you can get that too. I likely won't, but you can if you want it.

Oh and Dio people dont' go resto for the 5% crit when they spec PvP, its good use and all but that's not the *PvP* spec. When I spec PvP with Jabbers, while I still have that talent, Focused Mind is where its all at. Reduce your silenced duration so when you are locked out, it doesn't last as long. Its huge.

I forgot about that first point being the case, and suddenly understand other peoples specs looking so damn odd and so deep into Enhancement.

On the second point though, my stint as a PvP Elemental Shaman has not even begun yet - my spec was designed for solo play and most of the stuff I was preaching about comes from an underlining understanding and research of the way the abilities work and how useful they are. It'll take experimentation to learn how useful the talents are, though.

In light of the deal with the Spell Critical Strike in the Enhancement tree though, I think I'm going to be running with a spec like this (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?shaman=553000150321535100530351000000000000000000 000000000052520010000000000000000000) now instead.

[Jabiba]

Here will be my raiding spec, which works just fine for solo. In all honesty the anti pushback seals the deal on solo specs. High enough spell damage and you kill stuff before it hits you, but now with that, it doesn't matter quite so much.

Jabiba @ 80. (http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=hEG0qcdjtMxst0xxco)

Elemental Oath is straight up 5% crit. can you crit once every 15 seconds? I'd be surprised if you said no, add in elemental mastery to START with a crit.. and you're already in 5% added heaven.

I can understand not getting the raid totem since flametongue is a suitable replacement. No crit, but still the spell damage.

And astral shift is just Groovy. I can see it useful in some raid instances too but I didn't have the points for it. But it'll be nice for solo play and some PvP play.

One key difference in our enhancements is what I found and decided upon why this is my final spec unless they change things. Improved weapon enhancements. Flametongue Weapon now grants us spell damage, those talents improves the damage it gives us by 30%.. pure raw bonus spell power.

Also I personally believe that improved guardian totems is worthless. Stoneskin reduces damage before armor is taken into place, so its not really the number that it states, and seeing how elementals wear mail and a shield.. its not as nice as it looks. As for grounding totem. It was nice when grounding totem went on 'cooldown' (for 15 seconds) but still stayed out when it absorbed a spell. Now it goes away at any spell and the cooldown is 45 seconds.... the cooldown to redrop the totem. Yeah that number always existed but when it used to absorb a sheep and be ready to absorb something else in 15 seconds.. making that 13 seconds made a difference.. 45 seconds to 43 seconds.. in my opinion isn't worth it. Stick those two points in Elemental Weapons instead.

OR, you could place those two points in enhancing totems. And increase the damage amount that flametongue totem grants you. But if you're going to bother improving flametongue totem, i'd recommend just getting the more powerful spell damage totem that only costs one talent point.***

*** Unless!! you know you'll be partying with another elemental, in which case I'm going to assume the totems (read: double totem of wrath) won't stack, so a flametongue would be warrented for the "stacked" spell damage.

[Fhenrir]

Oof, Grounding Totem got nerfed to 45 seconds? That's a pretty big hit to shamans in arena play.

[Chikt]

Also I personally believe that improved guardian totems is worthless. Stoneskin reduces damage before armor is taken into place, so its not really the number that it states, and seeing how elementals wear mail and a shield.. its not as nice as it looks. As for grounding totem. It was nice when grounding totem went on 'cooldown' (for 15 seconds) but still stayed out when it absorbed a spell. Now it goes away at any spell and the cooldown is 45 seconds.... the cooldown to redrop the totem. Yeah that number always existed but when it used to absorb a sheep and be ready to absorb something else in 15 seconds.. making that 13 seconds made a difference.. 45 seconds to 43 seconds.. in my opinion isn't worth it. Stick those two points in Elemental Weapons instead.

I was looking at the skills and the description for Grounding Totem is still the same as it was in WoW, or is this a stealth nerf? I've heard nothing of it.

If that is the case, yeeeah... two extra points elsewhere. Probably into Storm Reach I think, or Enhancing Totems.

[Jabiba]

>.>

Before I continue, I would like to state that when you're past your 24 hour marker... don't type out as much as I did by memory.. double check here and there.

That said, my brain confused mechanics trying remember the old and the current. So.. To get my facts together!
Grounding Totem: 15 second drop cooldown, 45 second duration
Old Version: 15 second drop cooldown, 45 second duration.. but it wouldn't get destroyed when it absorbed a spell.. so it would come back up after about 5 seconds.

My brain confused that all around because I didn't specify drop cooldown.. and yeah.. whee. Still though, to me the two seconds isn't worth it. You'll be busy casting spells for one, and the other, 13 seconds is still a long wait in the middle of pvp. Further more if you're in on 1v1... Earthshock + Grounding Totem (vanilla) is enough to get the job done. This is of course my opinion, feel free to spec it and see if you like it, but I doubt I will ever spend any points there.

[Skaadvik]

You can't purge bubble.

[Kaliera]

You can't purge bubble.

Though he didn't specify which bubble, I imagine he was speaking of Blessing of Protection, which some people still refer to as a paladin 'bubble' in reference to the old graphic.

[Chikt]

>.>

Before I continue, I would like to state that when you're past your 24 hour marker... don't type out as much as I did by memory.. double check here and there.

That said, my brain confused mechanics trying remember the old and the current. So.. To get my facts together!
Grounding Totem: 15 second drop cooldown, 45 second duration
Old Version: 15 second drop cooldown, 45 second duration.. but it wouldn't get destroyed when it absorbed a spell.. so it would come back up after about 5 seconds.

My brain confused that all around because I didn't specify drop cooldown.. and yeah.. whee. Still though, to me the two seconds isn't worth it. You'll be busy casting spells for one, and the other, 13 seconds is still a long wait in the middle of pvp. Further more if you're in on 1v1... Earthshock + Grounding Totem (vanilla) is enough to get the job done. This is of course my opinion, feel free to spec it and see if you like it, but I doubt I will ever spend any points there.

The OLD version you're looking at is the OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLD version. Grounding Totem hasn't been that OP in a long time.

However, I'm going to have to disagree with you on the usefulness of those 2 seconds being gone because it's not the intention that the moment you throw down Grounding Totem it gets absorbed and immediately goes away again. Rather, you throw down grounding totem when you see one of the high DPS classes doing one of their big powerful spell attacks (i.e. Pyroblast) and throw it down mid-cast. It eats up the pyroblast and saves you from taking damage.

In the effort to keep yourself and your team alive, every second counts, and two seconds can feel like an eternity. This isn't to mention that the Resto four piece PvP set bonus removes an extra second and a half.

On Paladins though (Specifically Ret), I actually have been finding them pretty easy to beat as Elemental when I changed the way I fought them. Spam purge and kite them around with frost shock. Save your big DPS attacks and hold onto your mana and do most of your damage with frost shock. They'll eventually be forced into a bubble and start healing, giving you a chance to heal yourself (throw down grounding totem first) and the moment they get out of that bubble, rain down hell upon them while kiting them.

If they pop their bubble and go running after you, run away from them. Boars Speed on your boots is SO damn useful here because you can keep them at a distance. Try to keep Grounding Totem down as long as possible. Then once the bubble is down, blow them up.

If they pop their wings before they pop their bubble, then skip the first part and just DPS them down. You can remove their free action buff every time they cast it and just continuously frostshock them to keep them at a range. I'm not sure if the wings are dispellable, I THINK they are.

If they use Blessing of Protection... dispell that shit and beat them up for being silly around you.

[Qabian]

A mage would have to be pretty loopy to actually put a casting time into Pyroblast and not put Presence of Mind behind it. Longest I usually see a mage cast taking in a PvP situation would be a 2.5 second Frostbolt (unless they're using a PvE spec, in which case you may get a 3 second Fireball or 2.5 Arcane Blast) so whether or not to Grounding a Mage is probably more of a consideration of what cooldowns they have used already and how many hitpoints you have left.

If you suspect PoM Pyro, they will likely try to whittle you down far enough that the duration of counterspell-silence with a PoM Pyro/Fire Blast will be the last hurrah, so Grounding would be a desperation 'oh shit' move intuitively anticipating the counterspell. Likewise, if you get caught in a Frost Nova/Frostbite, especially if already at reduced health, you likely have a Frostbolt/Ice Lance incoming and if you can't be successfully silenced, they may try to fake out the cast to prompt an early Earth Shock, leaving Grounding as the best option eat the Shatter damage?

I've never had someone pull that off on me in either situation, but I imagine that's how it would work?

Until next week anyway!

[Jabiba]

There are many bubbles in the game. Protection, divine, Priest bubble, Priest's Discipline "can't purge me" bubble, Mana Shield, Ice Barrier. All of these have the "bubble" look to them. If I wanted to declare god mode I would have. :P And God Mode "Divine" is the only one the shaman cannot purge.

And yes I did say "Pally bubbles" but I grouped them with Priest Bubbles as well. Divine I just ignore because I cant' do a thing about it, but priest bubbles can affect anyone so I'd imagine i was referencing protection as that can be cast on anyone. And further... if your enemy still has all of their buffs, that blessing of protection might as well be god mode because try purging it off now? fat chance.

[Tillna]

Ok..on the PTR..Lighning strike + AB + LM = broken.

Somethign about launching a hunter and his chimera off to the ground is just epic.

The changes to the totems make em super nice, nad the other proc on crit works on healing spells...And since I don't have 2/4 t4 I'm using earth living to boost my quick heals a bit

[Muatah]

The biggest mistakes I see Shamans make are -

1) Not purging.
2) Trying to cast other-than-instant spells when people are beating on them(BUT IT"S MY BIG DAMAGE SPELL!!!!!!......woof)
3) Not using Earthbind/Grounding

The good Shamans I fight are constantly Kiting/Ghost Wolf running away.

If they stand still and try to cast Lightning Bolts you get to laugh as they die in 4 seconds.

[Jabiba]

70% anti pushback will change that dynamic immensely though. We had it for a short time as a 4 piece PvP set... I could take an warriors and hunters alike. Not all the time, but it was doable. But yes, purging is powerful stuff, get rid of the bonuses and anyone is an easier kill.

[Chikt]

PvP as elemental is AMAZINGLY fun.

Running around at Dalaran using Thunderstorm on on all the Alliance sitting on the cliffs looking into the crater was one of the most fun things I have EVER done in this game. As well as getting my "win a duel" achievement by punting Yatokth to his death.

What SUCKS about Thunder is that it's a knockback no a punt. People are pushed outwards, not up and outwards. So even just a TINY lip that they are standing on, causes them to just bounce a few inches in place.

Not so much of an issue in arenas with all the flat area, but still.

I think Elemental PvP will be THAT much better by 80 when we have Lava Burst though.

[Taknar]

Oh man, you have no idea how crazy it was when it had lift to it. It was fun for the shaman sure, but it was a) increased downtime for the affected b) more ways to fall off things.

[Yatokth]

PvP as elemental is AMAZINGLY fun.

Running around at Dalaran using Thunderstorm on on all the Alliance sitting on the cliffs looking into the crater was one of the most fun things I have EVER done in this game. As well as getting my "win a duel" achievement by punting Yatokth to his death.

/cast Bladestorm
/yell GET TO DA CHOPPA!!

Yatokth has died.